Devil's Cut

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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Fyn » Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:45 am

Iam enjoying a pleasant time this evening experiencing my first taste of Devil's Cut. I have enjoyed Wild turkey for 30+ years, my favorite is the Distiller's Select 101 proof 10 y.o. of a few years back (since cut to 80 proof). I am also a fan of single malts, especially the peat whiskys of Isle of Skye. I am enjoying some different notes in the DC, a sharp front edge, a woody spice center and fading slightly sweet finish. The finish was the surprise and kept me coming back for another taste. This whiskey lacks the vanilla oak long finish smoothness of a Woodford Reserve but then I like it for the woody spice center. A different whiskey for me. Soon my lover and I and going to do multi tasting of JB, JBB 8 y.o., Devil's Cut, Wild Turkey 101, Wild Turkey Distillers Select 10 y.o. 101 and Buffalo Trace - should be quite the evening.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby kyjd75 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 9:26 pm

I have tried to give it a fair shot, but I just don't like it. Surprising to me, as the Beam small batch products are among my favorites (especially Bakers and KC), as well as Jim Beam Black. Trying to decide now whether to keep the bottle and try to finish it over time, or just pour it out. It just doesn't work for me.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Bourbon Joe » Sat Feb 04, 2012 9:33 pm

kyjd75 wrote:I have tried to give it a fair shot, but I just don't like it. It just doesn't work for me.


Me neither.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Bourbon HQ » Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:28 pm

I'll third that.


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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Watson Roadster » Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:34 pm

Birdo wrote:Tried it and liked it quite well. The Beam lineage comes through as you would expect. Complex taste profile, nice mouth feel. Only draw back is a bit of roughness, probably from the 4y/o Beam White it is cut with. Overall, a solid product , but Beam black is better for $3 less.

All that said, I'll buy Beam Black and Knob Creek before DC>


I agree with this...It's not bad stuff.It's pretty solid on it's own,but Black is superior and it's cheaper.I'm an unabashed Jim Beam fan,and I like this offering but there is a pecking order in things.And this places in 3rd behind Black and White.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby kyjd75 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:07 pm

kyjd75 wrote:I have tried to give it a fair shot, but I just don't like it. Surprising to me, as the Beam small batch products are among my favorites (especially Bakers and KC), as well as Jim Beam Black. Trying to decide now whether to keep the bottle and try to finish it over time, or just pour it out. It just doesn't work for me.


I poured it out.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Raven 6 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:30 pm

kyjd75 wrote:
kyjd75 wrote:I have tried to give it a fair shot, but I just don't like it. Surprising to me, as the Beam small batch products are among my favorites (especially Bakers and KC), as well as Jim Beam Black. Trying to decide now whether to keep the bottle and try to finish it over time, or just pour it out. It just doesn't work for me.


I poured it out.


Man, wish I had caught that. I would have been happy to paid the shipping and enjoyed the rest for you.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby dickelfanaustralia » Thu May 24, 2012 7:55 am

Has this got that lightness of beam white i like? not too toasty.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby dickelfanaustralia » Wed May 30, 2012 4:31 am

Devil Cut is advertise like ever square foot in Australia. And there is no age statement. I've never tried it. Are they just trying to copy Wild Turkey.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby Birdo » Wed May 30, 2012 11:21 am

dickelfanaustralia wrote:Devil Cut is advertise like ever square foot in Australia. And there is no age statement. I've never tried it. Are they just trying to copy Wild Turkey.


Devils cut is no Wild Turkey. Devils cut is a gimmick where Beam extracts waste bourbon from empty bourbon barrels and mixes it with 4y/o Beam white. It's good, but a bit expensive for what it is. Even though they are using waste product, I think its costly to extract and that drives up the cost, or it could be marketing and placement that makes this expensive.

You would be better off with Wild Turkey 101, or Beam Black. But you should try a shot of Devils if you get a chance.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby ebo » Wed May 30, 2012 8:40 pm

My only complaint with Devil's Cut is the price. It's not a complex, ooh and ahh kind of whiskey. It's a simple, one dimensional whiskey that tastes good.... period. Gimmic? I don't think so. Beam tried a new approach... good for them. It just costs too much for a simple whiskey.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby EllenJ » Thu May 31, 2012 12:33 pm

I am a little curious about one point unique to Devil's Cut; that is, of course, assuming that the premise is true and not just marketing hype the way "moonshine" has become lately. If most, or at least a substantial portion, of the whiskey in the bottle is reclaimed from dumped "barrelage" (is that a word? I guess it is now), then the taxes for that whiskey have already been paid and passed into the price of their regular products.

Remember that the whiskey is taxed by the barrel, not by the contents-at-dumping. For example, a 53 gallon barrel of 130-proof whiskey "contains" about 34½ “proof gallons” of alcohol, at least as far as Uncle Sam is concerned. The fact that a goodly portion of those 53 gallons aren’t there anymore is what is meant by “the angel’s share”. But the taxes have been paid on them just the same; that cost is simply factored into the price the distiller charges on the finished cases. The same holds true for whiskey that remains in the barrel after dumping (and that can be quite a bit, especially with modern high-speed processes). That’s the basis for the play on words – if “lost whiskey” during aging is the “angels’ share”, then lost whiskey at the dumping stage might be thought of as the opposite, or “devil’s cut”. Either way, the cost of the taxes (which is a major factor in the cost of the product) have already been charged out to White Label, Black Label, Knob Creek, Booker’s, Old Grand Dad, etc. and the production cost of “Devil’s Cut” is likely to be less than half that of regular 4-year-old Beam product. And then, on top of that, you get to charge a premium because this bourbon is “special”? WHAT A DEAL!!! Sheesh! I wonder why no one else ever thought of doing that before.

Maybe they have…

I can think of several old iconic standards that have been hailed as “classics” that might actually cost less per case to bottle (due to the fact that the federal taxes were already paid and factored into the price of the original whiskey years ago) than that whiskey did when it was new. Now, consider that most of those thousands of bourbon barrels sent to Scotland and Jamaica, etc. are sent in broken-down form (i.e., barrelheads and stacks of slats), and you realize that gathering (and tanking) of those last couple gallons per barrel has been going on for a long time. It’s probably nothing new at all, except that Beam’s marketing wizards (Fred Noe? That wouldn't surprise me; that’s his training and background and he’s shown himself to be one of the best at it) have chosen to promote it as an individual premium product in its own right instead of simply using it to reduce the cost of existing brands.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby EllenJ » Mon Jun 04, 2012 11:30 am

EllenJ wrote:...the whiskey is taxed by the barrel, not by the contents-at-dumping. For example, a 53 gallon barrel of 130-proof whiskey "contains" about 34½ “proof gallons” of alcohol, at least as far as Uncle Sam is concerned.

Actually, I'm not completely sure about that. Maybe BourbonV can help. I'm thinking now that the tax is applied to the 125-proof entry level, which would make the proof gallons a (more or less, since that entry proof is nearly universal) constant 33.12½. The "percentage of alcohol" may (and usually does) increase with evaporation (since more water evaporates than alcohol), but the actual amount of alcohol doesn't increase. Either way, the logic remains the same.
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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby gillmang » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:34 pm

John, I'm not sure how the taxes work, but I'd be surprised if a refund or credit isn't granted for the angel's share. I suspect though the government applies a fixed scale for this purpose, i.e., it may assume shrinkage is at x % per year regardless of the actual loss. So if I am right, the distillers can win or lose depending on actual shrinkage, but knowing how governments usually work, I'd guess the system usually works in its favor.

But as you say maybe Mike, or Chuck perhaps, can enlighten on all this.

As for recovering usable ethanol from the barrels after dumping: I don't think the Scots do this, the reason is, first, the staves would likely lose the alcohol faster than when the barrel is intact; second, they usually de-char and re-char the staves before rebuilding the barrels, so any alcohol left in is burned off. I don't know this for sure but believe that is how it works.

Brown-Forman for years has recovered whiskey from the dumped barrels for Jack Daniels and they use it as part of the water to dilute the whiskey for bottling and maybe entering, so cost is lessened of course that way. Not sure if other distillers do the same.

I tried Devil's Cut and didn't like it, the keynote flavor of Beam whiskey which (to me) is a strong, funky-like yeasty note, seems concentrated in that product, so I steer clear of it.

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Re: Devil's Cut

Unread postby bourbonv » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:27 am

Tax rates have not changed - $13.50 a proof gallon paid when coming out of bond. The gauger's manual has a figure as to how much whiskey should be in the barrel after x years of aging. If there is more whiskey than the manual states, then the distiller pays tax on the extra. If there is less whiskey than the manual states, then the distiller pays taxes on the amount the manual says there should be in the barrel. It is a win/win situation if you are the government, but for the distiller, not such a good situation.
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