Bulleit?

[Oregone]

I'm a little confused by the bourbon review on this whiskey. Not a lot of detail there, so I'm interested in opinions, but I'm also confused by what I read about where it's distilled. Is it Four Roses or Buffalo Trace?

[angelshare]

My understanding is that the currently available so called "frontier whiskey" is distilled by Four Roses, while the previous version in the square bottle was distilled elsewhere (I assume AA/BT based on the info here, but I couldn't remember for sure).

I enjoy Bulleit, and think it is priced very reasonably for the quality. I'm looking forward to doing a side-by-side with the new FR SB sometime in the not-too-distant future!

[TNbourbon]

There was a Bulleit Thoroughbred 90 proof in the mid-Nineties distilled at Ancient Age/Buffalo Trace. It is no more, at least production-wise. The current bottling is distilled and bottled at Four Roses, but is owned by Diageo, I think, who purchased its rights from Tom Bulleit. (Chuck will correct me if I'm wrong.)

[Strayed]

It was Vivendi, not Diageo, that bought Seagram's. Diageo just owns most of the other spirits companies

Vivendi didn't buy the Four Roses distillery, though. They only wanted Universal Studios... oh, and Captain Morgan. It was the Japanese brewery, Kirin, that bought the Lawrenceburg (KY) distillery. They were also the Asian distributor for Four Roses, which is the top bourbon brand in Japan and other Asian countries, so it made sense to pick up the source when Vivendi put it up for sale. At the time of the sale, Tom Bulleit had an arrangement with Seagrams to make and distribute his Bulleit bourbon, and they were very enthusiastic about promoting that brand. I think it was always Tom's, though. Tom Bulleit is a fascinating person, very persistant and dedicated to making his brand of whiskey successful. I don't know what his arrangement is with Kirin, but it doesn't look like it's about to fold up and die.

The Thoroughbred Bulleit was 100 proof. The 90 proof version was just Bulleit. We have examples of both in our collection. They're not the same as the Frontier bourbon. They were made by Ancient Age (Buffalo Trace) and in fact use the same bottle as Elmer T. Lee is now sold in (ETL had a different bottle then). It's also the same bottle as Wathens. The whiskey was good; similar to AAA ten-year-old, although the marketing hype was that it was Tom's ancestors' personal recipe. Tom's association with Ancient Age seems to have broken around the same time they became Buffalo Trace. Bulleit disappeared, but only briefly. It resurfaced as the Frontier Bourbon we now know. This is made at the Lawrenceburg Four Roses distillery and is very different from the Ancient Age version. It has a whopping portion of rye in the flavor profile and is much more believable as being Tom's family's own individual recipe. Of course, it could also be any of Seagram's several recipes that they use in mixing their Four Roses bourbons, since that's the way they make whiskey there, but who cares? It's unique and for bourbon enthusiasts, that should be all that matters. If that sounds like a plug to go out and grab a bottle of Bulleit Frontier Style, well it is.

[dgonano]

The current Bulleit is indeed one of my favorite pours. It was probably the brand that got me back into bourbon about five years ago.

[bunghole]

Never had any. Not available in Virginia. The unofficial motto of the VA ABC must be "If it ain't fer sale - Then it ain't worth buyin'!". Yeah, right! As you look at a forty dollar bottle of Theadford on the top shelf.

[cowdery]

The current Bulleit, the so-called "Frontier Whiskey," is made by Four Roses under contract to Diageo. In fact, about half of the output of the Four Roses Distillery is sold to Diageo for use in various brands, primarily as the straight whiskey component of blends such as Seagram's Seven.

What a waste.

Anyway, Bulleit uses the Four Roses high rye mash bill and is about 30 percent rye, a little higher than Old Grand-Dad and hence the highest of any bourbon. Four Roses makes that mash bill using five different yeasts, as it does the other one, so I don't know exactly how many different whiskies there are in the Bulleit mix. The single barrel, of course, is by its nature one mash bill and one yeast, but I think it's the conventional bourbon mash bill that's used for SB, not the high rye one, though I'm not positive.

The SB is superb, by the way.

I'm not certain exactly what Tommy's arrangement is with Diageo but they have been making a big investment in the brand, so they must have a long term distribution arrangement at least, if not an ownership stake. Tommy is definitely along for the ride.

Veach can tell you better than I can about how someone, either Tommy or someone at Diageo, concocted what I think has to be an embarassing fake ancestor for Tommy as part of their "frontier whiskey" hype, which I think (and say in my book, among other places) is a wholly unnecessary bit of hokum laid on a perfectly good whiskey.

[angelshare]

Not available in Virginia.

Good news, Linn - it is now! The asking price is $20, and I'm fairly sure I've seen it at the Harrisonburg store on 33 near the new Kohl's.

The unofficial motto of the VA ABC must be "If it ain't fer sale - Then it ain't worth buyin'!".

I thought that was their official motto!

Yeah, right! As you look at a forty dollar bottle of Theadford on the top shelf.

Definitely. Double the eye roll on that one.

[bunghole]

Thanks for the heads up, Dave. $20 is double what it should be selling for, but may pick up a bottle in Kentucky.

[bourbonv]

Chuck,
The Fake Bulliett story has been around for about 6 to 8 years. I did some research on it for Chris Morris about 5 years ago and came up with nothing - no census records, no tax records, no city directory listing, nothing!

Diagio and Tom Bulliett have, I think a similar relationship as Julian and Buffalo Trace. Whoever makes the I W Harper for Diagio probably makes the Bulliett Bourbon. I had assumed with slumping sales of Harper in Japan, that Bulliett is now simply Harper in a different package, probably made at Bernheim.

Mike Veach

[Oregone]

Anyway, Bulleit uses the Four Roses high rye mash bill and is about 30 percent rye, a little higher than Old Grand-Dad and hence the highest of any bourbon. Four Roses makes that mash bill using five different yeasts, as it does the other one, so I don't know exactly how many different whiskies there are in the Bulleit mix. The single barrel, of course, is by its nature one mash bill and one yeast, but I think it's the conventional bourbon mash bill that's used for SB, not the high rye one, though I'm not positive.

The SB is superb, by the way.

I bought a bottle last night, and I have to say, I really enjoyed it -- well, not the whole bottle, but I enjoyed what I drank. Then again, Four Roses is among my most favorite bourbons, so I'm not surprised. Very floral in the mouth, which reminds me both of FR and also speaks to the high rye content, I should think.

But there's a Single Barrel version somewhere? I didn't see any reference to it on their website and it's certainly not on the shelf here in Oregon.

--Jeff

[cowdery]

Single barrel Bulleit, Jeff? Not that I know of. If you got that from me, I gave you the wrong impression. I was talking about the Four Roses Single Barrel, not a Bulleit SB.

Mike, I don't know if Harper is one of the products Four Roses is producing for Diageo or not. It could be they're buying whiskey from Bernheim/Heaven Hill for Harper, I don't know. For all I know they're making it in Tennessee. I do know for a fact that Bulleit is produced for Diageo at Four Roses and that it uses one or more of the bourbons that are also in the Four Roses mix.

Julian still seems to be running his own marketing, even since his alliance with BT, while Diageo is definitely driving the Bulleit bus, marketing-wise.

[Oregone]

Single barrel Bulleit, Jeff? Not that I know of. If you got that from me, I gave you the wrong impression. I was talking about the Four Roses Single Barrel, not a Bulleit SB.

Ah, that was where the confusion arose. I would love to try the Four Roses single barrel; the Black Label is one of my desert island bourbons. Weren't there plans to start selling Four Roses throughout the US?

--Jeff

[cowdery]

The problem at this point is mainly one of supply, in part because so much of the distillery's output is going to Diageo. Both the standard yellow label and the new SB are available pretty readily in Kentucky and perhaps in some adjoining states. If you are familiar with Four Roses from overseas travel, it is only the yellow label and the SB that are available here and the USA SB is different from the one sold internationally. Different proof, different bottle and different whiskey.

[Oregone]

The problem at this point is mainly one of supply, in part because so much of the distillery's output is going to Diageo. Both the standard yellow label and the new SB are available pretty readily in Kentucky and perhaps in some adjoining states. If you are familiar with Four Roses from overseas travel, it is only the yellow label and the SB that are available here and the USA SB is different from the one sold internationally. Different proof, different bottle and different whiskey.

I'm more than anxious to try it out. I've had the Black Label from overseas, and the Yellow Label (a number of years ago) was sent out from Kentucky. Maybe Binny's will start carrying it.

--Jeff