George T. Stagg

Talk about rare, export, annual release and other types of similar bottlings here.

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Unread postby White Lightning » Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:08 pm

What about guys who actually are enthusiasts ~but buy 10+ bottles of Stagg when it's in such limited supply. While I grant they plan to enjoy it, being in such limited supply that sort of irks me too, especially when equally deserving enthusiasts have been trying for 2 years unsuccessfully to get one bottle.

I fear there are three parts to all those annoying inquiries you get. One is the greedy SOBs that want more than their entire state is allocated, Second you get the poor SOBs that legitimately can't get a bottle because of the greedy SOBs and then Third you get the pure SOBs - who could care less but heard about it (such as via playboy).
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Unread postby Dave » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:34 pm

A couple of thoughts.

If it was just the proof that people wanted, they could always go for Bookers. I don't think it's the proof.

It's not the snob value of expense, 'cause there are alot of more expensive bourbons out there.

I think it's the rarity.

I like what the mail-order houses do. You can only order two bottles. And if you're lucky, you might just get one or two. But you have to be on the waiting list.
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Unread postby parshooter » Tue Oct 19, 2004 4:06 pm

I had never heard of Stagg's until I recieved a bottle in a secret Santa gift exchange last year. I fell in love with it. I think Dave is right with what he said about why people buy it. I buy it to drink it. Dose everybody think the same is true with Eagle Rare 17 ?
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Unread postby westsideelectric » Tue Oct 19, 2004 5:53 pm

I'm w/ you, Marc...never even heard of GTS until I received a bottle as a gift last year and I loved it. I think those of us who are fans of the cask strength single malts found a natural bourbon match w/ GTS. I find Eagle Rare 17yr. to be in an entirely different category myself, Bro. It's the stuff I break out only on special occasion...not because of price or rarity, but because it's so damn smooth and tasty (hell, even non-bourbon enthusiasts seem to appreciate it) that I have a hard time putting the bottle down once I start pouring... :drunken:
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Unread postby tlsmothers » Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:11 pm

I think it's the rarity.


I liked the points you make. It's not super expensive and the it's not the ONLY high proof out there. But rarity may not be the only frenzy for this. I think it's a combination of price, rarity, proof, and press. Eagle Rare 17 and Sazerac aren't loaded up, either, but I have a waiting list a mile long for GTS and less than 5 people looking for the other two.
"Drinking just to get drunk is like having sex just to get pregnant." --Robert Hess
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Unread postby TrueBarrel » Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:53 pm

I see Randall's has it, at their usual bargain price :roll:
http://store.yahoo.com/randalls/rws27449.html
You can't say you can't find it, though.
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Unread postby bunghole » Wed Oct 20, 2004 9:15 am

TrueBarrel wrote:I see Randall's has it, at their usual bargain price :roll:
http://store.yahoo.com/randalls/rws27449.html
You can't say you can't find it, though.


Yowch! :shock: I thought that a 100% profit would have been greedy enough, but 200% :!: :evil: :cussing:
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GTS

Unread postby JimC » Wed Oct 20, 2004 9:43 am

:oops: Read your vent on the GTS beggars just after I sent the PM begging for GTS. Sorry. Some of us rookies do get caught up in drinking the right stuff. To be honest though, at my stage of bourbon appreciation,
Elmer T Lee and Wathen's suit me much better than GTS; so pass over the request, but if you could, please give me your impression on the rest of that message.
thanks
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Unread postby TrueBarrel » Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:29 pm

White Lightning wrote:What about guys who actually are enthusiasts ~but buy 10+ bottles of Stagg when it's in such limited supply. While I grant they plan to enjoy it, being in such limited supply that sort of irks me too, especially when equally deserving enthusiasts have been trying for 2 years unsuccessfully to get one bottle.


For a moment, you almost made me feel guilty there. However, the reason those who want it can't find it is not because some have been able to buy 10+ bottles. One of my suppliers that runs multiple stores in a certain county said they don't get enough to justify shelf space but will take case orders only. She told me I was one of only two people who asked them for it!

Although this may not be what people want to hear, Stagg is available to anyone who wants it, except if all of the following apply (1) you live in a state into which it is illegal to ship spirits, (2) you are unable to convince out-of-state stores to ship into your state, (3) you don't know anyone in states in which it is available who can send it to you, and (4) you are unable or unwilling to travel to where it's available. The foregoing has nothing to do with how many bottles people buy. Now, is it easy to find? For many, absolutely not! It takes a lot of time and effort. You can't just wait 'till you hear it's been released and call your local store; in most instances, they'll say they've never heard of it. When they check with the distributors, they'll say the distributors can't get it or the allotement is already gone. Unless you already have a rock-solid source, you need to start your efforts early. After missing out in '02 and only being able to find one bottle of '03 last year (and from Randall's at that :roll: :x ), I spent hours online and on the phone early this summer bugging the sh**t out of my usual and other suppliers trying to track the stuff down. Amazingly, everyone I contacted came through. So after bugging them so hard for four months, I felt obliged to come through and purchase what they got for me, and that is not keeping others from getting it.


It's truly a shame they can't bottle more of it so it can be distributed more widely - but apparantly there just aren't enough barrels.

By the way, I'll trade some '04 for some '02. PM me.
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Unread postby doubleblank » Wed Oct 20, 2004 1:26 pm

My local retailer here in Houston has the Stagg '04 out on the shelf now. It's the only 2004 Antique bottling there. It was me bugging the distributor last year that got Houston all of 9 bottles of 2003. Glad to see they came through with some for 2004. I had already picked up some 2004 at the Festival, so I only picked up one here....leaving the other two bottles for the rest of Houston.

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Unread postby White Lightning » Wed Oct 20, 2004 4:36 pm

All of that is true True Barrel, but the added effect of greed does play a part in the problem.

For one, having to travel to KY to (maybe) get a bottle is kind of a stretch and defies logic for most. Secondly outside of KY in many regions first dibs are given to retailers who made Sazerac barrel purchases. With in that ring, there are individuals who work all the back channels just as you described. Only they go from one shop to the next upfront making advanced reservations on bottles. Unlike KY, all but a couple of overpriced shops get more than the standard (1) 3 bottle case (hence the frenzy of savvy callers like the originator of this thread complained about).

My post is not aimed at making you (personally) feel guilty. If I pulled all the strings at my disposal, I could probably end up with 10 bottles too. But to do so I'd have to deprive a couple of other people who in my mind are just as excited and devoted bourbonites as me or the next man.

The most enjoyable aspect of bourbon for me is sharing / comparing it and the experience it brings. I'm not saying the above is you -- but take a look at the tail of your post. You obviously have an extra bottle. So much of an extra, that you are willing to openly offer to trade it (with someone who is dillusional if they unearth an 02 bottle imho). But how about the guys who are bugging the hell out of tlSmothers not to mention a hundered or more other retailers getting the same earful?

Just a thought and not trying to impose any moral standards on anyone. Just hoping everyone is being mindful. Sone people followed some of the offered advice (finding someone who can purchase and mail) and this year stores in KY have restricted per/ person purchases because of it. I'm sure you know about this -no?

Lastly, it will be years (at least 5 but as many as 8 or more) before anyone can begin to think about GTS meeting demand. Which means this struggle will rage on year in and year out. . .
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Unread postby TrueBarrel » Wed Oct 20, 2004 5:24 pm

White Lightning wrote: My post is not aimed at making you (personally) feel guilty. If I pulled all the strings at my disposal, I could probably end up with 10 bottles too. But to do so I'd have to deprive a couple of other people who in my mind are just as excited and devoted bourbonites as me or the next man.


I think this may be the only point where we really disagree. I don't believe that an enthusiast picking up 10 bottles is depriving anyone else of Stagg, except perhaps for non-bourbon enthusiasts who know nothing about and don't even drink bourbon and who read about Stagg in Playboy. The stuff is available. Right now. It may not be at a good price, and you may have to jump through hoops, make calls, etc., but it can be had by devoted bourbonites.

White Lightning wrote: The most enjoyable aspect of bourbon for me is sharing / comparing it and the experience it brings. I'm not saying the above is you -- but take a look at the tail of your post. You obviously have an extra bottle. So much of an extra, that you are willing to openly offer to trade it


That's right. I'm willing to trade it for something I've not tried to someone who perhaps has not gotten/doesn't want to put in the effort to get Stagg. That's sharing. Each party gets something they don't have. I also just gave a bottle to a fellow bourbon enthusiast whose wife just had a baby and to another fellow bourbon enthusiast who just bought a house. These are people who have heard of and drank Stagg because of me but who would have no idea where to find it. Maybe this is one of the reasons I don't feel guilty about having acquired so many bottles. I'm actually fostering wider distribution to bourbon enthusiasts.

White Lightning wrote:But how about the guys who are bugging the hell out of tlSmothers not to mention a hundered or more other retailers getting the same earful?


I feel bad for them. That was me last year (not to Lenell, mind you, but to others). But I have not prevented any of them from getting a bottle. It's available. It's a distribution/knowledge problem, more than a supply problem.

Our exchange of thoughts and ideas are what make and will make this a great forum. This has been a good discussion. If you can't get Stagg, PM me your addy; I'd like to send you a bottle and won't expect anything in return except for future thoughtful discourse on all matters bourbon (or rye, of course!).
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Unread postby dgonano » Wed Oct 20, 2004 5:33 pm

I never pulled any strings and have found some on shelves in Md, just luck.. Also , by chance , ordered and received a few cases from one of the few retailers that could get their hands on it. Your chances of getting
any without ordering at least a case are slim.
Dave G.
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Unread postby White Lightning » Wed Oct 20, 2004 6:38 pm

Thanks for the reply T/B -

Glad to know you are not one of the guys that rousts up umpteen bottles then sits back in ammusement watching the crowd drool all over themselves.
:roll:
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Unread postby TrueBarrel » Wed Oct 20, 2004 6:40 pm

dgonano wrote: I never pulled any strings and have found some on shelves in Md, just luck.. Also , by chance , ordered and received a few cases from one of the few retailers that could get their hands on it. Your chances of getting
any without ordering at least a case are slim.


That's exactly what I've found. (I'm (obviously) in MD too.) Many retailers have explained to me that they've never heard of it and even if they find from the distributer that they can get it say it's a pain in the ass and not worth their time to order, receive, inventory and find shelf space for items they can only get in very limited quantities, which is why they'll get it for you but only if you'll take a whole case.
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