Charter 101 anyone?

[ebo]

I have not seen any reviews yet and I am not confident enough to post one my self (I am still just a bourbon student).

Barleycorn-pucky! Smell it, taste it, swallow it and write down what you think.

Can't get better until you start off bad. SB.com has a great list of terms for depicting different tastes... Just write sown what comes to mind.

Example:
It smells light and fluffy, sort of a tangential scent that wafers with odd melody.

The taste reminds me of something I cannot remember, but you kind or know right.

The finish is like a race with Tom-n-Jerry where you cannot really tell its a race before it is over...


Blah-blah-blah... Got a nickel you can write one better than this one

This is fun, not graded...

LOL... my favorite is still "wet pavement".

[393foureyedfox]

This one belongs on everyone's list of little-known gems. Glad you've discovered it. It's pretty widely available in Kentucky, but most of us won't find it on our local liquor store shelves (not even the bottom ones). However, we can mail-order it from the usual sources.

Old Charter was the main product of the old Bernheim distillery in Louisville until Diageo sold the distillery to Heaven Hill and the brand to Buffalo Trace. It had the reputation of being a very distinctively corn-forward bourbon, with estimates of 80%+ corn in the mashbill. That makes it pretty much an example of what really good corn whiskey can taste like when barreled in new charred oak (which you can't do with a product labelled "corn whiskey") and aged for a proper four years or more.

I don't know if Buffalo Trace continues the mashbill tradition. That would mean they have yet another mashbill besides the two rye-based bourbons and the wheater. But they might. Some people suspect that the juice sent to A. Bowman in Virginia might be the 80% corn recipe.

you know im still pretty much a newbie, LJ.....maybe i cant tell one recipe from the other. but i was sure it was something rye-heavy, as its got a nice spice and kick to it that makes me think of ryes. ive not tried any corn-heavy stuff before though. im still betting on it being rye-heavy.

either way, its one of the few id load up on if i heard it was being d/c'ed.

[EllenJ]

Buffalo Trace may have just chucked the old Bernheim recipe entirely and begun filling the bottles with regular BT juice. Their #1 mashbill (Buffalo Trace bourbon, Stagg, Eagle Rare) is pretty corn-heavy anyway. I'm going to have to buy a bottle of current Old Charter and test the differences.

EDIT: Whoa! I just took a sip from a bottle of Classic Twelve. What a HUGE difference!
______ Okay, it *is* 12 years old, and that's a big difference is anyone's whiskey. But it's also from 1999, which means it was bottled, aged, and most importantly for this discussion, MADE (in 1987) by U.D. (or Glenmore) at Bernheim. I don't know if Classic Twelve is still available (I'll check later when I'm back at The Party Source), but if so it would have been made in 2001 and that would have been at Buffalo Trace. Then again, it still might contain only Bernheim (actually Belmont, the OTHER distillery at that location) whiskey that BT purchased along with the brand, or perhaps mostly that whiskey (remember, only the YOUNGEST whiskey needs to be 12 years old, and that could have been distilled at Frankfort; the rest of the whiskey in the bottle could be older and from United Distillers' stock, but I can't imagine why BT would use up 15-20 year old whiskey for a less-than-top-shelf brand - more likely that's going into Eagle Rare 17).

I most seriously doubt that any of the whiskey in a bottle of Old Charter 101 was distilled anywhere but at Frankfort.

[393foureyedfox]

whatever the current charter 101 is, theyve got my repeat business

i would be interested to know the mashbill though


anyone?

[Mike]

whatever the current charter 101 is, theyve got my repeat business

i would be interested to know the mashbill though


anyone?

I hauled out my bottle of Old Charter 101 and wondered why it was so full. Not a bad bourbon, but because it is, as I recall, pretty much corn whiskey, it does not (in my opinion) stand up well to the 101 proof. A smidge of das wasser is needed to tame it a bit.

[Squire]

I've just been presuming (with no supporting evidence) that Charter uses the BT No. 1 mashbill.

[393foureyedfox]

i bought it because i was perusing the shelf looking for something new to try, and i only buy things over 100 proof. Id not seen this before at the smaller stores around my area, so when i saw it and the 'frankfort, ky" on the label, i figured i would love to try some BT at 101 proof. thats exactly what i expected....101 proof BT, and its what i still think it is.

until someone proves otherwise, im sticking with my rye-heavy assertion. it is very similar to the profile I enjoy of OGD 114 and FC 103 (hot, sweet, and spicy). regardless, i like it quite a bit, and the fact its so cheap makes it better still

[Mike]

I've just been presuming (with no supporting evidence) that Charter uses the BT No. 1 mashbill.

I have seen from several reliable sources that it is indeed BT Mashbill #1 which is reported to be about 80% corn.

[393foureyedfox]

whatever it is, its worth every cent

[393foureyedfox]

taken from buffalo traces media site...

Charter 101
101 proof “Rye Recipe” Kentucky Straight Bourbon Whiskey
The rich amber gold color is the first impact delivered by this whiskey. The next force to make an impression is from the incredible body and mass of the drink itself. Bold and rich whiskey flavors such as toffee, caramel and oak strike the palate. Subtle flavors like vanilla and molasses are also present, but even they are shouting. The finish is sweet and fresh with a suggestion of green tea and cotton candy. With a touch of water or on the rocks, it is tamed as much as a mustang spirit can be. Indulgent and velvety flavors abound, but a powerhouse is felt lurking on the tongue, ready for a taste adventure. In a cocktail, this bourbon whiskey bows to no mixer. Instead it invites the cocktail ingredients along on a tango of flavor, presenting them as seasonings on an extravagant bourbon experience. This is a bourbon for the extrovert who wants a whiskey that has enough personality to keep up.





so, at least this time, i wasnt crazy

[Mike]

No, you certainly weren't 'wrong', but though it has some rye, it isn't a 'high rye' bourbon. That you really like it, and I do not like it so much is as things are and should be.

It is just my opinion, and I may well be wrong in the opinion of others, that a 'high corn' bourbon is not suited to high proof.

[EllenJ]

Another possibility is that what Fox is ascribing to "rye bite" may be SOME of that, but also some of the fact that he enjoys higher-than-100-proof bourbon. That is, the alcohol factor may be PART of what he values, and he describes that mouthfeel as "high-rye". Thus a corn-heavy whiskey with a high enough alcohol content (Old Charter 101) is enjoyable in the same way that a rye-heavy whiskey might be. Remember that Fox also really likes Fighting Cock at 101 proof. Heaven Hill only has one bourbon recipe, so the rye content isn't a really a factor, but it certainly tastes corn-forward to me. Who knows? Maybe FC is really aged Mellow Corn?

Meanwhile, Fox, see if you can get examples of other Mashbill#1 BT whiskies, perhaps in minis so you don't have to buy whole bottles. Then use this formula (from Chuck Cowdery) to equalize their alcohol content and compare. Be sure that you bring the Old Charter down to the lowest denominator as well. It's best if you get a friend to do the actual dilution and present you with each in a glass so you can taste them blind. I see no reason to doubt that the Old Charter is actually BT#1, so if it's just a matter of proof you might not detect much difference between that (at 90 proof) and Buffalo Trace undiluted. Or you might find there are other factors beyond either the proof or the mashbill that make for quite noticeable differences. Try it and let us know.

Chuck's formula for dilution is as follows: (amount of whiskey) x ((bottle proof/target proof)-1) = amount of water to add. So to dilute eight ounces of 100 proof whiskey to 80 proof you add two ounces of water and wind up with 10 ounces of 80 proof whiskey.

[393foureyedfox]

but who wants 80 proof whiskey?

[Squire]

Anyone who can't get there with 80 proof whisky ain't trying hard enough.

[393foureyedfox]

its not for the point of getting 'there', squire. i never drink to the point of getting drunk, and have been there only a few times. the thing i hate about 80 proofers, from what i have experienced at least, is that they taste bland, and seem like they WERE something decent before someone watered it down.