Early Times and Old Forester

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Early Times and Old Forester

Unread postby bourbonv » Wed Jul 26, 2006 11:02 am

Gary has done an excellent review of Early Times Bourbon, before it was Kentucky Whiskey. In the review he makes some references to Old Forester expecting a comparison in taste. He appears to be suprised at the differences. This should not be the case because they are two totally different products with seperate mash bills and yeast.

Every year at the Woodford Reserve Bourbon Academy the participants get a chance to taste and compare Early Times and Old Forester both in the aged, finished product and as a white dog product. Early Times white dog is very flavorfull with lots of corn flavors and very little fruit or spice from the yeast or the rye. Old Forester white dog is more fruity and complex. These difference also come through in the finished product. Early Times has always been a more grain driven flavor with mild barrels tones. For me Old Forester has always had more fruit flavors from the yeast and caramel flavors from the barrel.

These are great examples how the same distillery can make two completely different flavor profile products by varying the grain and the yeast.

Mike Veach
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Unread postby gillmang » Wed Jul 26, 2006 11:20 am

Mike I understand everyting you said but there is still a family resemblance between the 60's-70's Early Times bourbon and the current OF and WR. There is something that connects the two. The yeasts may be different, but how different I am not sure. Anyway it's a fine dram.

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Unread postby bourbonv » Wed Jul 26, 2006 11:43 am

Gary,
The will be some similarities between the brands because it is the same stills and water source as well as the same company makes barrels for both brands. Those common threads may be what you are tasting in both.

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Unread postby gillmang » Wed Jul 26, 2006 5:36 pm

Could be Mike, I'd call it an "aromatic wood quality".

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Unread postby bourbonv » Thu Jul 27, 2006 9:34 am

Gary,
That makes the most sense. Both brands get their barrels from the same source since Brown-Forman owns Bluegrass cooperage. I don't think there is any difference in the char levels or any other treatment of the wood that goes into the barrels. The most important factor her may be that they are aged in the same warehouses that are steam heated in the winter.

Another thought that just came to me is the fact that as far as I know, the brands are not segregated in the aging process with Old Forester barrels in the same warehouse as Early Times barrels. I wonder how that effects the aging of the whiskey? Is there some minute migration of airborn whiskey from Barrel to Barrel. If there is, it would have to be of microscopic perportions, but could it give Early Times a hint of Old Forester flavor and may even vice versa? A question I will have to ask next winter at the bourbon academy.

Mike Veach
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Unread postby gillmang » Thu Jul 27, 2006 1:24 pm

That is a very good question, Mike.

I'd have to think there is some mutual influence. E.g. to take a more obvious example, say you aged some Old Forester in one warehouse exclusively, and then filled a second one built the same way and (as near can be) with the same "microclimate", except the second one was half filled with rye whiskey or brandy and the remainder with Old Forester. I would think the whiskey in the second warehouse would on average be different, "organoleptically", than the whiskey in the first one.

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Unread postby bourbonv » Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:19 pm

Gary,
The warehouses at Bernheim under United Distillers was a real mixed bag with brandy, rye, corn and bourbon aging side by side in the warehouses. It does make me wonder what effect that had on flavors. I don't suspect that there much, if any impact, but it does beg for the question to be asked.

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Unread postby EllenJ » Sun Jul 30, 2006 12:26 am

Ooooh! Historically, that would introduce a whole new aspect, too. In the MERCHANTS' warehouses where individual barrels of whiskey were kept in the 19th century, those barrels would have been sitting with tobacco, pickles, vinegar, turpentine, etc.
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Unread postby Bourbon Joe » Sun Jul 30, 2006 9:07 am

That wonders me now John. I wonder if Jim Beam ages their white label in Turpentine warehouses?
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Unread postby EllenJ » Sun Jul 30, 2006 5:32 pm

Prolly not, Joe. It would have at least picked up THAT flavor. :wink:
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