Vat's Dis?

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Vat's Dis?

Unread postby Mike » Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:24 pm

Jest messing around, I wondered what Maker's Mark, Old Potrero Rye Malt Whiskey, and Beam's Red Stag would taste like vatted together. So I took 50 ml of MM, 5 ml of RS, and 7 ml of OP.

The nose carries a tad of the RS (I can identify the cherry aroma), a touch more of the OP (the rye spice nutty aromas) and a smidge of the MM leather.

As you would expect the taste is on the sweet side from the MM and from the RS. There is a decided rye bite in the finish courtesy of the OP. Overall, It tastes more like a potent cocktale with just a splash of marischino cherry juice than like a vatting of whiskies.

Pretty good, actually. Barleycorn wants to know when I will be making more of this stuff because it tastes like barbeque rabbit to him.
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Rage, rage against the dying of the light. - Dylan Thomas
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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby gillmang » Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:43 pm

Sounds perfect, very 1885 Jos. Fleischman.

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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby BostonEnthusiast » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:56 pm

Mike--

I was just about to try a Red Stag Manhattan when I saw this post, and I have all of the ingredients! Next into the shaker -- I'll let you (and Barleycorn) know what I think.
Kevin

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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby BostonEnthusiast » Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:20 pm

Fascinating suggestion! It turns out that I didn't have the exact ingredients -- I substituted MM Black for the red wax, and my Old Potrero is the 18th Century version. (Hopefully the more flavorful MM cancels out the more raw OP!)

COLOR: Dark honey (all constituents are about the same color to begin with!)

NOSE: I can detect all three components; the cherry from the RS over the medicinal OP, but a bourbon base sits behind it. Unfortunately, they don't knit together.

TASTE: Very cool -- MM vanilla yields to Red Stag cherry then the rye bite of the Old Potrero before coming back to bourbon with a cherry on top. Much more integrated than the nose.

FINISH: Smooth on the tongue (much smoother than OP alone!) with a little bite in the throat. All of the burn seems to come from the Old Potrero.

I think Mike nailed it -- this is a cocktail rather than a vatting, but an impressive one! (It's the cherry that puts it over, but the Old Potrero makes it serious.) I might try another mix, skipping the MM this time.
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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby gillmang » Sat Sep 12, 2009 9:42 am

I think the Red Stag taste remains evident and suggests a cocktail because of the amount used, just under 10%. That does not sound like a lot but the Red Stag is quite sweet though. In the 1800's, flavourings were added in different proportions and 10% was by no means unusual.

Still, I looked again at Fleischman for his best bourbon blend (see the extracts of his book at http://www.pre-pro.com):

McBrayer Whiskey, 20 gallons
Mattingly Whiskey, 20 gallons
Monticello (Rye), 5 gallons
Prune Juice, ½ gallon

(McBrayer and Mattingly were both straight bourbons. Also, the prune juice can be peach juice or any other fruited extract, he gives recipes for various fruit-based mixtures for this purpose).

One-half gallon out of 45.50 gallons is about 1% only - very small. All his fruit mixtures were spirit (GNS)- based, and the Red Stag is even better being bourbon itself - just a very sweet one. The Red Stag is, therefore, a perfect substitute for a GNS-based peach or other fruit juice. So is Southern Comfort. So too would be a sweet port or sherry.

If you try these combinations with that small a percentage, I believe the addition will not be noticeable, yet it will have served its purpose which is as a catalyst, essentially.

Of course, the final taste will be a function of the specific components. Maybe the perfect balance would be reached with a 2% addition or even 5%. It depends on each case and each person's taste. Still, it would be interesting to try something close to what Fleischman advises. I may do this tonight.

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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby gillmang » Sat Sep 12, 2009 10:00 am

Alright here is my plan. For McBrayer I will use a ND Old Taylor 80 proof. For Mattingly, I'll use Bulleit. For the rye, I'll use a vatting of ryes I have: 4 ryes of at least 18 years old each. For the fruited catalyst, I will use probably Southern Comfort. This should work well, stay tuned.

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Re: Vat's Dis?

Unread postby gillmang » Sat Sep 12, 2009 4:50 pm

Here is an update. I did try this, but I used a 15-bourbon/rye mixture I had on hand as the base. I added just a little rock and rye, Jaquin's, which has a lemony top-note. The result is excellent, a well-knitted whiskey with a rich chocolatey taste that resembles nothing so much as a Martell Cordon Bleu.

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