A Rye Time on the Old Town Tonight

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A Rye Time on the Old Town Tonight

Unread postby Mike » Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:33 pm

As I have matured in my appreciation of American Whiskies, I have certainly come to focus more on Ryes. The first time I really tried Rye, about 4 or 5 years ago, I thought it was a bit too strongly flavored. I no longer think so.

I am not sure why that is.............I have speculated on the fact that as I grow older (I was born in 1849, in honor of Old Fitzgerald 1849, even if it wasn't available then, I knew it would be some day, thus making me 158 years old........I need to call Guiness Records tomorrow about that), I seem to be gravitating toward stronger flavors, but I have always had somewhat an affinity for them.

Be that as it may (and pardon the above digression........younger folks are much more drawn to pictures and 'sound bites', while an old bastard like me prefers the power of the written word.............I know John Lipman, Mike Veach, Gary Gillman, bunghole when at his best, Tim (TNbourbon), MikeK, and even Chuck Cowdery can appreciate that anachronism, since they are often likewise afflicted).

Today, come I to speak at Ceasar's funeral, he was my friend, faithful and just to me...........oops, I seem to be having a flashback here.

Today, come I to discuss and sip 4 (four) well known rye whiskies. They are Van Winkle Family Reserve Rye, Sazerac Rye (6 year old sometimes known as Baby Saz), Wild Turkey Rye, and Black Maple Hill 18 YO Rye.

I do not have the older Saz, or Rittenhouse, but I do have Old Overholt but couldn't include it out of a desire not to piss my wife off by having too much whiskey. The older Saz and Rittenhouse are not available to me and the OO is 80 proof so I don't think it is quite as flavorful as the others. If you want to know what I think of it (by and large favorably) read my review of it.

While not inebriated, since my vet and I have proscribed more than a small sip at a time, I am enjoying myself immensely as I undertake this important work!

VAN WINKLE FAMILY RESERVE RYE

Nose: ripe fruit (peaches), leather, wood, nuts, spices........excellent
Taste: sweet and spicy, sweet and spicy, and subtle too, no raw edges
Finish: long, spicy that grips the throat, but never throttles it

SAZERAC RYE

Nose: cinnamon, crushed flowers, spice, coca cola.........incroyable mes amis!
Taste: of a piece with the nose......cinnamon, sweet flower nectar, ginger spice, one of those 'how did they squeeze so much flavor from the grains'
Finish: warm, but not long

WILD TURKEY RYE

Nose: fermented fruit, rich and creamy with leather and spices playing with your aromatic module........ the nose, the nose, every chef knows it is in the nose...............great flavors must be pre-validated by the nose. If the nose falters, the taste can never be great (Mike's first law of tasting).
Taste: nose and taste are in an accord here, sweetness followed by a barely contained spicy zap that has the tell-tale Wild Turkey signature bite that brings your spirit alive.........you cannot be passive and enjoy Wild Turkey Rye............it does not allow it.

BLACK MAPLE HILL RYE - 18 Years Old

Nose: soft sweet spices from dried fruit peels and crushed flower petals, leather, all very subtle, non assualtive and sublte, soothing and relaxing and..........impressive
Taste: subdued sweetness with a mild jolt of spice about mid-palate. 18 years in conversation with the barrel were productive in moderating and melding all flavors............makes you want to sit back and sip slowly so the flavors have time to unfold
Finish: Non assertive but not passive........the zing is somewhat delicate but gives up slowly



Which, for you 'sound bite' souls, is my favorite?..............all none. Each stands on its own and is entirely enjoyable on its own merits.

In whiskey, as in life, picking winners and losers is a STUPID game, don't do it. Enjoy the variety............there is no BEST of anything (that is not to deny that some things are BETTER than others), and to think there is and to pursue it is downright childish.......a futile exercise in egoism!
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light. - Dylan Thomas
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Unread postby MikeK » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:17 pm

Mike, you silver tongued devil. Your words are wise and true. Must be the influence of such fine drink. Your rye choices are among the very best in my opinion. I am also very partial to the 18yo Saz. The Rittenhouse is very nice as well, but in a lighter weight category than the other players.

Have you ever had the Rittenhouse? If not we'll have to find a way to get you some.

I also find Fleischmann's to be an amusing pour from time to time. It is very light and fruity, with the presence of old time Bazooka bublegum.

I am not so fond of Beam, Overholt, or Pikesville. I think the only rye out there I still need to try is Stephen Foster.

Cheers!
Mike
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Unread postby Mike » Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:59 pm

Mike, my wife (my rudder in this life............how does she know so much more than me when, to my mind, I try so hard to be wise?) and I are going to make it one day to your part of America. When we do, a sip or two with you will be topmost on my agenda. You are my kind of guy!
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light. - Dylan Thomas
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Unread postby MikeK » Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:56 pm

The door is always open Mike. Beauregard agrees. He probably figures he'll have an easy shot at the catnip while I'm distracted entertaining you and your lovely bride.
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Unread postby BTBFlyboy » Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:38 am

I am a newby on this forum but have discovered Rye Whiskey myself. As a devoted Jack Daniels fan I was somewhat conflicted when I found there was a new rye whiskey being distilled in my home state of Iowa. But being a good loyal Iowegian I decided to give this new whiskey, Templeton Rye, a try.
I found it to be very smooth and much to my liking though the taste of a rye whiskey I found to be completely different from a corn whiskey/bourbon.
Has anyone else on this form given Templeton Rye a try as of yet and if so what is your opinion of it ???

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Unread postby EllenJ » Tue Apr 03, 2007 12:20 am

I, too, am anxious to try Templeton Rye, but I believe it's not available outside of Iowa yet.
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Unread postby xlperro » Tue Apr 01, 2008 1:19 am

EllenJ wrote:I, too, am anxious to try Templeton Rye, but I believe it's not available outside of Iowa yet.


Binny's in the Chicago area has it available. It appears they ship to some states. I just ordered some myself.

http://www.binnys.com/search/spiritsear ... =19&astxt=
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Unread postby Bourbon Joe » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:01 pm

EllenJ wrote:I, too, am anxious to try Templeton Rye, but I believe it's not available outside of Iowa yet.

I tried some at Whiskeyfest last year John. I was not overly impressed.
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Unread postby cowdery » Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:08 pm

Templeton is available in Illinois. It is good but nothing special, really. It is also not made by them in Templeton, Iowa. It's something they bought and bottled. Although they do apparently have a still they are a non-distiller producer in terms of the product on the shelves.

They refuse to disclose who made it, of course, but swear it was not one of the usual suspects. I suggested that perhaps they got it from Alberta and they neither confirmed nor denied that.
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Unread postby EllenJ » Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:03 pm

Joe and Chuck, I've heard there are two versions. I believe they actually DO distill some rye whiskey, but I doubt they've had time to age it yet for distribution. Chuck, I understand you're going to be at the ADI whiskeymakers' conference next week; I was hoping to go, too, but I won't be able to. You'll almost certainly get a chance to learn more about Templeton there. I think their idea is to keep solvent (no pun intended) by putting SOMETHING saleable (that isn't vodka) into the bottle ASAP, because like most of us, they just don't have six to eight years' worth of operating capital at their disposal. Presenting it at Whiskeyfest this year gets the name out there, and MOST of those who try it will be more impressed (positively or negatively) by its being a "new rye whiskey" than by its actual flavor. Of course a lot of Whiskeyfest-goers are folks who enjoy whiskey personally and are looking to be introduced to something they might buy a dozen bottles of in their lifetime. But many are professionals -- potentential dealers and restauranteurs, not to mention writers whose validity depends on their success in picking "winners". Those people are mostly looking to see if it will sell well off their shelves. People, such as yourself, who have some experience with rye whiskey may be unimpressed, but if I were starting up a new rye brand I'd do the same thing. A few years from now, when it's my OWN product going into the bottles, I know you'll be impressed, and this way I can afford to make that happen. At least that's what I'd LIKE to believe. Most new brands don't actually ever do that; they end up either making only vodka or gin, or just going broke. I'm hoping Templeton will be different.

I always thought the rye they used came from Barton (Fleischmann's), but what Chuck said about Alberta seems pretty interesting. Especially if the Templeton folks are really consciencious about rye. Along with their other basic Canadian whisky brands, Alberta Springs markets the only 100% rye whiskey commercially sold anywhere. That's whisky made from a rye-only mash and using rye malt. I used to have some (I think Chuck might have tasted it here). It's not particularly impressive; I never felt a need to replace the bottle when it emptied. But it certainly would qualify as a pure rye product, and I'd give Templeton credit if that's what they're using. Besides, when they release their own distilled/aged product it would almost certainly generate additional press interest because of the improvement!
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Unread postby EllenJ » Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:11 pm

Mike, you started this thread over a year ago, but I re-read it because of what JoeBourbon added the other day:
Mike wrote:...I was born in 1849, in honor of Old Fitzgerald 1849, even if it wasn't available then, I knew it would be some day, thus making me 158 years old........I need to call Guiness Records tomorrow about that..

Hey, buddy, I'm three years older'n you are. I was gonna call Guiness myself... but of course I forgot.

What I DIDN'T forget (on accounta I only need to go downstairs to refresh my memory) is that today's rye whiskey (made anywhere from ~1987 to 2000+) tastes more like pre-1970s rye than bourbon of that age tastes like pre-'70s bourbon.
From my point of view that's a good thing.
A VERY good thing.

Now, from a cultural point of view, to SOME people (oh, and I can already anticipate the hate-mail on this), ONE reason -- I'm not sayin' it's the ONLY reason -- Bourbon whiskey isn't considered "sissy whiskey" is because it comes from KENTUCKY; and no one would ever accuse a Kentuckian of being "sissy". No one currently LIVING, anyway. But the fact is that Bourbon tends to get associated with lawyers, writers, horse-breeders in oak-paneled clubrooms, and country politicians. While Rye whiskey is for steelworkers, dock hands, betters on horse-races, and big-city precinct politicians. There is certainly more than just a little bit of "I can handle more pain than you can" about Rye whiskey. Of course, once you get past that part, it is truly a wonderful spirit. My own preference is for rye whiskey when I want to really FEEL the drink, and bourbon whiskey when I want to enjoy the subtlties and layers of flavor.

Mike wrote:...In whiskey, as in life, picking winners and losers is a STUPID game, don't do it. Enjoy the variety............there is no BEST of anything...

Truer words were never spoken.
By no one.
No where.
No how.
I'm John Lipman, and I approve this statement.
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